Interview with Indian, Pakistani Seeds
BBC News

Two young people extending the hand of peace across the divide between India and Pakistan. 25-year-old entrepreneur Qasim Aslam from Lahore in Pakistan, and 23-year-old law student Parinaz Vakil from Mumbai in India share their experiences of working towards a better future. 

Matthew Bannister (BBC): Hello and welcome to Outlook from the BBC World Service. This is Matthew Bannister with more extraordinary personal stories from around the world. Today … two young people who are working for peace across the divide between India and Pakistan. […]

There are many conflicts around the world which just seem to defy all attempts at resolution—historic, deep-seated struggles where mistrust and hatred are deeply embedded on both sides. Examples include the conflict between Israelis and Palestinians, and the tensions between India and Pakistan. There have been many attempts to break down the barriers, so far without great success. But now a project called Seeds of Peace is targeting the next generation of potential leaders in conflict zones like these, in the hope that seeds planted today will bear peaceful fruit in the future. Young people who join this scheme attend summer camps in the United States and take part in exchange visits to homes in each other’s countries.

I’ve been talking to two of them: 25-year-old entrepreneur Qasim Aslam from Lahore in Pakistan, and 23-year-old law student Parinaz Vakil from Mumbai in India. I asked Qasim what preconceptions he had about Indian people when he was heading off for his first summer camp in the USA.

Qasim: I had never met an Indian before I went to Camp. Most of the stories that we had heard about the Indians were through our parents, through our grandparents, and most of those were pertaining to Partition and how the Hindus had brutalized the Muslims while they were migrating to Pakistan. So we had a very demonized image of the Indians in mind.

Bannister: And when you got to the Camp, did you have trouble meeting up with the Indian kids? Did you have arguments with them?

Qasim: I was just 14 years old and I didn’t care that much, so when they arrived they were just like any other kids. But once we actually got talking about our histories, we saw that there were quite stark differences in our histories, and I realized that they were attacking the version of history that I had learned throughout my life. And then all of a sudden that pseudo-patriotic sense kicked in and then I started hating them.

Bannister: Right, so you did get into some quite violent arguments about the different versions of history?

Qasim: Not necessarily violent, but definitely passionate arguments. After quite a few days of heated arguments, we actually realized that they’re quite friendly people. They’re actually, you know, just like us.

Bannister: Now Parinaz, you went to Camp for the first time in 2002, a year later than Qasim. Did you have a similar experience?

Parinaz: Absolutely, absolutely. There were a lot of times when we disagreed. We argued, we fought. But at the same time, we got along so well.

Bannister: Did it make you challenge your idea of what the truth actually is?

Parinaz: Absolutely. You go there with this history that you’ve studied, and then you go there and they, like Aslam said, have an absolutely contrary version of the same history. So, you know, it really makes you question any information for that matter that you just take as truth.

Bannister: It’s interesting that it wasn’t just people from Pakistan and India at this camp, as I understand it there were also people from across the Israeli-Palestinian divide. Were they going through the same experience and the same anguish, really, of challenging each other’s point of view?

Parinaz: In my opinion, I think it was a lot easier for the Indians and Pakistanis to get along than it was for the Israelis and the Palestinians. They got to Camp [and] literally freaked out about each other. I mean, in my year there were kids that didn’t want to sleep in the same bunks because they were scared that they’d be hurt by the other side while they were sleeping. But for the Indians and Pakistanis it was a lot easier to be friends.

Bannister: Right. I was going to ask you about that, Qasim, because presumably you and Parinaz met. Did you find yourself becoming friends despite the differences between you?

Qasim: Absolutely. Like Parinaz said, Indians and Pakistanis also have quite a few interests in common, like Bollywood movies and sports—we’re passionate about the same sports. So we had a lot in common. We had a lot to talk about.

Bannister: And Parinaz, do you keep in touch outside of the Camp?

Parinaz: Initially, when we got back from Camp, we kept in touch very frequently. But then people started working, or school happened, and at least in my experience, we would contact each other less frequently, maybe once in two weeks, maybe once a month. But in times of crisis, for example, whether it’s a natural calamity or a bomb blast, not even necessarily in the city where the Seeds are, we find that you get inundated with calls from the other side. And I think it’s really, really remarkable given the fact that it’s not easy to call the other side in times like that. Chances of your phones being tapped, chances of the police coming knocking on your door asking why you’re calling them, are quite high in times like those.

Bannister: Well, it’s interesting, Qasim, because not only did you go to Camp in the United States, but you also went on a Homestay in Mumbai with the family of a friend from the Camp. Did you feel nervous when you first went to Mumbai?

Qasim: Not at all. I was actually curious about the differences. It was interesting to see that once we landed, it was pretty much the same.

Bannister: I think, Parinaz, you had quite an interesting journey by bus traveling to Pakistan for your Homestay experience.

Parinaz: We were the first year that went to the other side. We actually got to alight from the bus at the border, and walk across the actual White Line. We got such an amazing reception on the other side. We were ushered into this special diplomatic guesthouse and given cold water to drink. I mean, it was fantastic hospitality.

Bannister: But of course, Parinaz, you had an experience of the reality of the conflict, because you were in Mumbai when attacks happened on the hotel there and on other areas in the city. Can you remember where you were and what happened to you during those attacks?

Parinaz: I stay not far from the Taj Mahal Hotel—I stay about 30 seconds away. It was an awful place to be for those three days.

Bannister: But there was a lot of anti-Pakistan feeling in Mumbai after those attacks. Did you see any of that?

Parinaz: Well, I did. There was a candlelight vigil that was being held about three days after it ended. And not far from me there was this group of really burly men who were shouting slogans. Well everyone was dealing with it in their own way—there were people who were talking against the government and I mean, heaps of things—so I didn’t really pay much attention to it. Until I heard someone scream “Pakistan murdabad,” which essentially translates as “death to Pakistan.” And at that point I don’t know what quite what got into me.

I wielded my way right into the middle of the mob. My mom was quite terrified. And I started screaming to be heard over their shouting. And I asked them who they thought actually did this, what it is they thought they were going to achieve by, say, bombing Pakistan, whether they actually thought that killing innocent people was going to achieve anything. I just kept asking them all these questions. And slowly they began to answer me. They started questioning me. They started questioning my loyalties, you know: “What side are you on?” “How can you justify this?” They questioned me; I responded to them.

On that really high emotional note, we were actually engaging in dialogue. And I really do believe that Seeds of Peace is to—well, I can say blame—but, yeah: it has to be given complete credit for it.

Bannister: Qasim, it’s an interesting name: Seeds of Peace. Do you think that by planting these seeds, the organization is going to have an effect on the future conflict between the two countries?

Qasim: The ideology of Seeds of Peace is to train the leaders of tomorrow so that they can be better than the leaders of today. So as far as ideology is concerned, I think they’ve got it spot on.

Bannister: Qasim Aslam in Lahore, and Parinaz Vakil in Mumbai.

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